Episode summary
Testosterone Expert: The Truth About DAD BOD & Why Women Find Fathers More Attractive!
The Diary of a CEO
· · 1 hr 29 min · Hosts: Steven Bartlett · Guests: Darby Saxbe
Summary
Darby Saxbe argues that fatherhood and parenthood reshape the body and brain in adaptive ways, even when the changes look like loss at first glance. She says fathers tend to show gray-matter reductions, especially in the mentalizing and visual networks, and that these shifts are tied to more efficient social cognition rather than worse empathy. She also says men typically experience about a 25% drop in testosterone when they become hands-on fathers, with the sharpest declines often appearing when dads are more involved in caregiving.
She frames these biological changes as part of a broader trade-off: parenting is hard, sleep-depriving, and sometimes isolating, but it also increases purpose, connection, and long-term well-being. Saxbe says the best outcomes come from a flexible middle ground, not from maximizing testosterone or minimizing father involvement. She also argues that parenthood can be neuroprotective later in life, with studies showing younger-looking brain age among people who have had more children, especially around two or three kids.
The conversation also emphasizes relationship dynamics. Saxbe says conflict during pregnancy, especially criticism, contempt, and stonewalling, is linked to more stressful and medically complex births, while validation and good communication can soften the transition. She is skeptical of narratives that treat daycare as universally harmful, and instead argues for practical support such as paid leave, child care, and policies that make parenthood less precarious.
Key takeaways
- Darby Saxbe says fathers show gray-matter shrinkage, but she interprets it as more efficient social processing rather than damage.
- Saxbe says hands-on fathers typically show about a 25% drop in testosterone, and the decline is usually adaptive, not pathological.
- She argues that the healthiest fatherhood pattern is flexible and mid-range, because very high or very low testosterone can create relationship and mood problems.
- Saxbe says more negative conflict during pregnancy is associated with more stressful and medically complex births.
- She says parenthood may be neuroprotective later in life, with UK Biobank data suggesting younger-looking brain age among people with more children, especially two or three.
- Saxbe argues that family policy, not just individual planning, matters for fertility because parenting should be easier to sustain socially and economically.
Notable quotes
“typically men when they do this show about a 25% drop in testosterone”
“Fathers are really useful for humanity”
“the brain is actually working more efficiently because it's building better connected pathways and better channels for communicating information”
“So great fathers are made not born. There's a lot you can do”
How the episode opens
You've discovered something about the brain I think is quite surprising.
So we found that in fathers the brain is actually shrinking and I'll explain why but also there are studies that find that both men and women who report having had more kids have markers of a younger looking brain age and then also typically men when they do this show about a 25% drop in testosterone. The next studies of single women have found that, you know, if you show them a series of body types, the dad bot is the most popular
And that's proven by science. So, if I go out and get a dad bot, you're telling me the science that says I'm going to be more attractive. — Yeah, go for it. — See what my fiance says. The other thing that's worth talking about is Have you done any studies on that?
Yes. That is one of the most robust findings in parenthood research and my lab found actually that — Wow. So, I've always been really interested in families and becoming a parent is one of the biggest transformations that you can experience, but I'm concerned about the declining birth rate. And I think that we've managed to market it as an undesirable choice.
According to the CDC and Pew Research data, the US total fertility rate just hit an all-time recorded low. — Yeah. I mean, the transition to parenthood can be really challenging. You are sacrificing yourself. It can be very isolating. You're losing your sleep. But becoming a parent, you are benefiting from this sense of connection and purpose. You will rediscover your priorities in a way that will ultimately bring a lot of value.
So if all goes well, next year I will be a dad and I would like you to give me some advice on becoming a father based on all the research that you have.
From the episode’s captions: roughly the first two minutes, lightly cleaned. Keep watching on YouTube →
Topics
- parental brain
- testosterone changes
- dad bod attractiveness
- paternity postpartum depression
- parenting relationships
Companies and tickers mentioned
- SHOP
- Shopify
- LinkedIn Talent Solutions
- Pipedrive
Watch the episode
Summary, takeaways and quote selection by Octagon. Quotes are short excerpts; the full conversation is in the episode.
More from The Diary of a CEO
-
Top Neurologist: The Weekend Habit That Could Raise Your Dementia Risk! -
Katt Williams: They Tied Me To A Pole And Beat Me Bloody Every Week! -
Iran War Expert: "The 8 Weeks After Midterms Could Be The Most Dangerous!" | Prof Robert Pape -
James Talarico: Here Is How They Designed The System To Keep You Poor! -
WW3 Threat Expert: The Warning We Are Ignoring, The Only Way Out Is THIS! | Dr Sarah Paine -
Mark Cuban: The Brutal Truth About The Next Market Crash!
The Diary of a CEO, this episode and its artwork belong to DOAC. Octagon is not affiliated with the show; this page is an independent summary.
