Episode summary
What Are ETF Flows Telling Us?
Bangers Only Podcast
· · Guests: Mike Akins
Summary
Mike Akins argues that ETF flows are a real-time read on investor behavior, but they need context. He says ETF Action was built to bring institutional-style data to advisors so they can verify what funds actually do, not just buy the story. The biggest theme in the market, in his view, is continued product expansion: more than 400 ETF issuers now compete in a market that had about 40 in 2018, and that growth has pulled in everything from active stock-picking funds to synthetic-income and single-stock products.
On cash and fixed income, Akins pushes back on the idea that money market balances are simply proof investors are scared. He says the cash share is more normal relative to market size than the raw $7 trillion to $8 trillion headline suggests, and he sees fixed income flows shifting from mutual funds into ETFs. He also thinks the market has become less afraid of duration if the Fed starts cutting, which could make longer-duration bond ETFs more attractive.
Crypto flows, he says, remain powerful but are still driven more by individuals, advisors under client pressure, and hedge funds than by broad institutional allocation. He is constructive on the ETF wrapper and expects continued growth, but he is more skeptical that most advisors are fully committed yet. On active ETFs and income strategies, he says distribution and tax structure matter, and investors should not confuse income products with long-term capital appreciation tools.
Key takeaways
- Akins says the ETF market has expanded from about 40 issuers in 2018 to over 400 today, making product scrutiny more important, not less.
- He argues money market balances near $7 trillion to $8 trillion are less alarming when viewed as a share of total market capitalization.
- He sees fixed income ETF flows favoring active core-plus and ultra-short strategies as investors rotate out of mutual funds and back into bond exposure.
- Akins says crypto ETF demand is still being driven more by individuals, advisors, and hedge funds than by broad asset-allocation mandates.
- He says active ETFs are drawing meaningful flows because major asset managers have strong distribution, even if active stock picking still faces skepticism.
- He warns that synthetic-income and single-stock ETFs can be useful tools, but investors need to understand the tax and downside risks before buying them.
Notable quotes
“We wanted to bring institutional level data sets to the advisor community”
“Today, there's over 400 um issuers in the marketplace, right? So, a almost a 10 t-fold growth in just the people that are building products and bringing them to market”
“I think people are reading a little too much into seven eight trillion dollars in money market”
“people are leaving their mut mutual fund core fixed income and coming into the ETF market finally because there's trust in it”
“the evidence still suggests that this story is not a story of asset allocators yet”
How the episode opens
Welcome to the Bangers Only podcast, where Tom Leiden and his band of experts make money talk exciting. Here's your host, Tom Leiden. Hi, I'm Tom Leiden.
Welcome to Bangers Only. Life is short. We've only got so much time.
We want to make sure we're concentrating on what's important in life. That's what Bangers Only is all about. Today I'm very very excited to have this guest, Mike Aikens, who's the founding partner of ETF Action.
Mike, welcome. It's great seeing you. Oh, it's great to be here, Tom.
Thanks for having me on. I'm I'm excited to be able to tell all my nieces and nephews that I'm officially a banger and they can start thinking of me as not the boring uncle. I'm the All right.
All right. I know the context in terms of ice water here a little bit. Come on.
Come on. Look, um, you and I could nerd out for hours about the ETF marketplace and that's the world that you live in. Talk about ETF Action for a second and and what you folks provide for adviserss.
Yeah, you know, ETF Action is a firm. We founded in 2018, myself and a couple of the guys that worked for me at Alps. I was ahead of ETFs at Alps for well over a decade building out their ETF lineup.
We wanted to bring institutional level data sets to the advisor community. Right. So you and I have been playing in the institutional data world forever, but it really was despite the transparency of the ETF, they were still being sold based on story, based on, you know, the strategy and the overall marketing of it.
But in reality, the transparency of the ETF opened up a world of being able to evaluate truly on function.
From the episode’s captions: roughly the first two minutes, lightly cleaned. Keep watching on YouTube →
Topics
- etf flows
- money market funds
- fixed income flows
- active etfs
- crypto etfs
Companies and tickers mentioned
- ETF Action
Watch the episode
Watch “What Are ETF Flows Telling Us?” on YouTube
Summary, takeaways and quote selection by Octagon. Quotes are short excerpts; the full conversation is in the episode.
More from Bangers Only Podcast
Bangers Only Podcast, this episode and its artwork belong to Tom Lydon. Octagon is not affiliated with the show; this page is an independent summary.
