Episode summary
Jean Chatzky: How to Create a Forever Paycheck for Retirement
The Long View
· · 49 min · Hosts: Ben Johnson, Christine Benz, Amy Arnott · Guests: Jean Chatzky
Summary
Jean Chatzky argues that retirement planning should not stop at saving, because many retirees struggle just as much with spending their money. She says the hard part is moving from accumulation to decumulation, especially when account complexity, tax rules, Medicare issues, and fear of running out of money make withdrawals feel risky. A key theme is that retirees often find paycheck-like income psychologically easier to spend than drawing down assets, which is why pensions and annuitized streams can support higher spending than brokerage balances alone.
She has changed her mind about annuities and now sees them as one way to create a “forever paycheck” for the slice of assets meant to cover essentials and important wants. Jean says buyers should compare product types, costs, guarantees, cost-of-living features, and insurer strength, and she prefers top-rated carriers. She also contrasts annuities with TIPS ladders and other investment-based income strategies, stressing that the right choice depends on how much certainty, inflation protection, and market participation an investor wants.
The discussion also covers Social Security timing, sequence-of-returns risk, flexible spending, spouse alignment on retirement goals, work in retirement, and protections against scams and cognitive decline. Jean’s bottom line is that retirement works better when guaranteed income covers the non-negotiables, leaving the rest of spending room to flex.
Key takeaways
- Jean Chatzky says many retirees are reluctant to spend because the move from saving to drawing down assets is emotionally and mathematically difficult.
- She says a forever paycheck can cover about 20% to 30% of assets, with the rest left invested for growth, taxes, and inflation.
- Jean says fixed annuities protect principal, while variable annuities and RILAs can still lose money, so insurer ratings matter and she would stay in the A category.
- She argues that delaying Social Security can be attractive because each year of delay generally adds about 7% to 8% to the monthly benefit.
- Jean says couples should talk explicitly about retirement lifestyles because many do not share the same vision, and that flexibility in discretionary spending makes guaranteed income more valuable.
Notable quotes
“many retirees are not spending anything in terms of their principle. Some of them are spending a little bit but not nearly what they could be”
“The fixed annuities have a guarantee that you are never going to lose principle”
“This is a solution for the money that you need in combination with social security to cover your needs and your important wants”
“each year you wait to take Social Security generally equates to about a 7 to 8% bump in what you'll get in your monthly check”
“I've learned about what these products can do that other products can't. And so my mind has definitely been changed about that”
How the episode opens
Please stay tuned for important disclosure information at the conclusion of this episode. Hi and welcome to the long view. I'm Christine Benz, director of personal finance and retirement planning for Morning Star.
And I'm Amy Arnot, portfolio strategist for Morning Star. Today on the podcast, we welcome back Gan Chatsky. Gan is the author of a new book about retirement planning called The Forever Paycheck: The New Retirement Strategy to Spend More, Worry Less, and Never Run Out of Money.
In addition, she has written several other New York Times bestselling books about money and investing. She's also CEO of hermoney.com and host of the podcast hermoney with Jean Chatsky. She served as the financial editor of NBC Today for 25 years and is the financial ambassador for AARP.
She appears frequently on CNN, MSNBC, and was a recurring guest on the Oprah Winfrey show. Jean, welcome back to the Long View. Thanks.
Thank you so much for having me.
Well, thanks for being here and congratulations on your new book, The Forever Paycheck. We want to delve into the book today. But before we get started with some substantive questions about retirement planning, just wanted to ask, what made you want to go deep on this topic of retirement planning?
I think it was a couple of things. Um, I'm 61 years old and so in the guise of doing a little me search, this is where I've been living lately and where the people that I've grown up with have been living. But I also have watched people, including my mother, live in retirement over the past couple of decades.
and noticed the real difficulty that she and others have had spending their money, which to me seems incredibly sad. We we hear of course a lot about people who haven't saved enough, but for those who really have done the work and who have set themselves up so beautifully to then find that they just can't open the spot and live the lives that they had wanted to or planned on living is a real problem.
From the episode’s captions: roughly the first two minutes, lightly cleaned. Keep watching on YouTube →
Topics
- retirement income
- annuities
- social security gap
- sequence-of-returns risk
- financial fraud
Companies and tickers mentioned
- HerMoney.com
Watch the episode
Watch “Jean Chatzky: How to Create a Forever Paycheck for Retirement” on YouTube
Summary, takeaways and quote selection by Octagon. Quotes are short excerpts; the full conversation is in the episode.
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The Long View, this episode and its artwork belong to Morningstar, Christine Benz - Director of Personal Finance and Retirement Planning, Ben Johnson - Head of Client Solutions, Amy Arnott - Portfolio Strategist. Octagon is not affiliated with the show; this page is an independent summary.
